that may be so, but isnt it then much harder to wall vs a Slinged opponent?On the balance changes that directly affect slinging:
Which makes the slinger much more vulnerable in Feudal Age slings.
- Stone Walls have their HP reduced by 50% in the Feudal Age
I am not even sure if stone walling is a must for slinging, especially in 2v2. Why would you rush the slinger if his ally is coming with knts +2? Double palisade + houses should do a decent job, 1/2 towers(you can buy 100 stone with market) behind palisades in the worst situation.that may be so, but isnt it then much harder to wall vs a Slinged opponent?On the balance changes that directly affect slinging:
Which makes the slinger much more vulnerable in Feudal Age slings.
- Stone Walls have their HP reduced by 50% in the Feudal Age
Only as long as you're in the Feudal Age. Once you're in the castle age, your stone walls are back at full power.that may be so, but isnt it then much harder to wall vs a Slinged opponent?
i mean why dont pick all 16 teams :lol:16 teams have signed up but only allow 8 teams with highest rate? :shock:
Hm, you're right. We should put the 8 lowest rated teams in instead, nobody wants to see TheViper + Daut team anyway
you could made qualification stage games played simultaniously and stream only one game per round like in most (all?) sc2 tournaments or dont stream qualification stage at all. even one possible spot for winner of qualification would make me train seriously for this event. another way to make more players involved is to play on fast speed which is more intertaining for viewers.
I am not well versed on the history of the AoC tournaments. However just going off a few stats I can see - The EscapeAoE Twitch account has 1 Million views and the VooblyOfficial steam has 2.5M views. Escape AoE has 45 videos and Voobly has 3,044 videos. It seems to me that in the short time EscapeAoE has been doing what it is, the viewer count is going through the roof.
CS GO events aren't weekend events bar a very select few. You have the majors and masters events which have invited teams + qualifiers beforehand and then a 5-7 day LAN main event, or you have a larger league with LAN final afterwards.
You just can't compare aoe2 to the biggest esports... they are different worlds. Players in the biggest esports are truly professional, it is their job, what they focus 100% of their life on, the vast majority of players in aoe2, even the experts are either working or studying, and the tournaments are all (with the two recent exceptions maldives 1v1 8 man finals and the TG tourney final) played online.
But AoC don't have as many players and we need the players of level below 2000 same as we need 2k+. If there aren't players below 2k, there won't be players over 2k aswell.
. But AoE need open tournaments aswell, I enjoy it the way it is now with both open/invitational.
So in a nutshell I am glad that we are moving towards viewer, organizer friendly tournament setup with ONLY relevant high quality matches in tournaments and not the match-ups like Tyrant vs Gorlami.
Its not about 1600s getting bashed, its about weaker teams preparing and taking games from stronger opponents, like you could for example see in WIC by the nc-team or influenza/coccolino-team (there are probably more examples that im not remembering right now. Same goes for the Nation Cups). Also its probably nice for 1600s to play a few games against the players theyre used to watch (its not for the experts, I know. but its not always just about them). I dont say week end-tournaments with more or less invite only are bad, I just dont like that some people say it should be the (more or less only way) to hold tournaments.1600s will not learn anything by getting bashed in a game vs a 2.2k+, for that they would be better watching a stream with some commentary.
No, watching a stream (I assume you mean pro player's POV stream) does not help a 1k6, or 1k8+ for that matter, anywhere near as much as playing (a rec of) vs a better player. Post-game analysis with the recorded game at hand, evaluated in relation to one's own ingame-observation, -experience and execution, shows the differences of them compared to the better player and enables real eureka moments that give actual deep-learning material that can be directly translated to one's own ingame-observations and thus to better playing in the future.1600s will not learn anything by getting bashed in a game vs a 2.2k+, for that they would be better watching a stream with some commentary. I think rather the opposite, spectating has allowed players to improve easier and faster.
which doesn't exactly include the twitch-viewer base of casual players seeking to find entertainment.OneMillion said:where the top players in the future are going to come from? ... incentive to improve and the foundation of experience to compete at a higher level in future. ... incentive structure that drives the 2000-rated ecosystem
Inspiring new players to picking up the game and inspiring potential new competitive players are two distinct matters, and can be handled even detrimentally if one or the other is discarded, in seeking growth. Incidentally, these go in parallel with viewer- and player-oriented growth patterns, although the two not being reciprocally exclusive.ZeroEmpires said:How many games is someone like the viper going to play vs some 1600s in a tournament setting compared to how many he can inspire with his entertaining stream. Watching extremely one sided games is not fun for the viewers, where the outcome is already known, the pro player has to essentially waste their time and the person getting bashed won't even learn anything.
It's backwards having this kind of setup in this day and age, it's time for AoC to grow and not be stuck in the past.
Good point, the mentality. This mentality is a competitive nature. To be competitive, you need a worthy opponent. Every sword needs a grindstone to stay or become sharp. Any competitive player is not on a quest to gain something like inner growth, they are out to defeat someone they crave to beat, or to win something like a tournament. The grindstone is the question.MaSmOrRa said:The likes of TheViper, DauT, RiuT, etc. didn't get to the level they are today by "crying" about the lack of tournaments for their level back in the time they were just aspiring pros themselves. Those guys are at the top of this game because they have trained the hardest, played the most games and worked hard on their game. Anyone who wants to get there too, just needs to do the same.
Back when Viper was getting destroyed by DauT 9 out of 10 games, I don't think he was complaining about the lack of tournaments for tier 2/3 players. He just kept working on his game until he eventually reached his current level. And do keep in mind that back then tournaments were much less frequent than they are today.
I honestly don't understand the argument "oh if there was a tournament for my level, I would have motivation to train". If you don't have the motivation to train just because you want to be better, then you probably don't have the kind of mentality needed to be at the top level anyway.